Forum:Supranational Wiki Organization

__NEWSECTIONLINK__ li:Forum:Euverlandjswikizamme Alright, let's keep the discussions about a new UWN at a single page to keep the oversight a bit è :P

Name
We need to have a new name, United Wiki Nations, Wikia Union, and International Wiki Organization have all been used before. Any ideas? :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 09:28, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Wikian Community, Council of Wikinations? --Semyon 14:17, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Wikian Community is too vague. Council of Wikinations is possible. However, a council has a more advisory role, instead of a powerful organization that can act if necessary. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:19, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * League of Wikinations, Wikination Coöperation Organisation? --Semyon 14:25, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Wikination Coöperation Organization or Coöperation Organization of Wikinations (COW :P) is another option for me. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:28, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Let's avoid the latter. :P Also Coöperation Organization of Wikinations sounds strange. --Semyon 14:30, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Organization of International Micronations? World Wikination Forum? HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 14:31, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Forum doesn't really sound powerful :P OIM is a bit strange because of the "International Micronations". --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:34, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * What about International Organization of Micronations? I tried basing the name off of the OAS. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 14:38, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

I'm thinking we should definitely use wikination in the name rather than micronation, which means something slightly different. International Organization of Wikinations perhaps? --Semyon 14:45, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Sounds like International Wiki Organization, but the initials are different so.. Why not? :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:47, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, my mistake. It should've been wikinations. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 14:51, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Bart K raised a problem: the translation of IOW to Limburgish would be Tösjewikilandjszamme, while IWO was translated as Tösjelandjswikizaam. A bit too similar perhaps? :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:05, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Simply Supranational Wiki Organization? :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:21, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * The problem is that we then seem to be a assocation of wiki and not of nations and what's wrong with using a name of a previous organization? UWN was a good name Pierlot McCrooke 16:26, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * We are going to create a new system. The old name UWN is not clear: do we mean the old UWN or the new one? --O u WTBsjrief-mich 16:28, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Members
Alright, Semyon already proposed to group members into two categories: official and associate. To me this sounds like something reasonable. I'll give a list of members: The important factor for the official state is: if there is an active, working government, you can be official. Otherwise, you are an associate member. Are we on the same line? :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 09:28, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, this makes sense. --Semyon 13:12, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

How is it going to work and what are we going to do?
Now, we arrive at the point at which all other organizations failed. What is the purpose of the organization and how are we going to keep it active and prevent it from falling apart? I think the "newbies" who haven't participated in a supranational wiki organization yet, might give us some fresh insights :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 09:28, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * I propose a number of different departments, e.g.
 * Department of Culture (role is to arrange twinnings, run organisations such as HTA)
 * Department for Interwikian Justice (role is to arbitrate any disputes which might arise between the nations, or to judge any criminals who operate internationally.)
 * Department for Trade and Travel (role is to ensure travel between wikinations is staightforward, keep tariffs for interwikian trade low.)
 * Department for Development and Aid (role is to provide loans to member states to allow development of poor regions or after natural disasters.
 * Department for MORE IDEAS HERE.
 * Each full member state would appoint a representative (two/more representatives?) to each department. --Semyon 13:46, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Your idea is okay, but I wouldn't make it more representatives. We have to think about our user base. Most wikis have the same users, f.e. I'll probably have to represent Mäöres because of a shortage of active users.
 * On our Mäöreser forum the following has been said: Collaboration and keeping projects from getting inactive. More translations about the other wikis (which includes active embassies) and making political deals to keep the nations together. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 13:58, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, departments aren't a fantastic idea. My point was that there's plenty of things for an organisation to do - even if we just limit ourselves to town twinning and cultural exchanges. As long as we define what its role is carefully, there shouldn't be a problem, whereas if we just say 'the UWN is an international organisation' it's bound to fail because people have no direction and no idea what to do. --Semyon 14:06, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Indeed, but solely town twinning is not going to give the organization a very sunny goal. The organization should have enough "power" to keep nations active in case there are significant risks of inactivity or yet another civil war type situation. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:13, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

nations possible
I think the nations from New continent wiki should not be allowed considering the fact a new continent being found is very very impossible. But what if we invited the more possible micronations from Fantasy Micronation wiki. I can think of a few good nations that would be able to join. Marcus/Michael Villanova 12:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)


 * Those countries don't really fit for our purposes since they don't have their own site. I see it more as a side/alternate project. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 13:13, June 13, 2012 (UTC)


 * (edc) I think some sort of minimum criterion is certainly needed, e.g. 10 non-stub pages, in order to be considered for associate membership. As Oos said, to be a full member you would have to have an active government. --Semyon 13:15, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Fantasy Micronation is here; New Continent. :Both wikis are rather inactive, but the same could be said for Reptin and Adlibita. The principles of Fantasy are in line with our principles. New Continents is of a different style. A thing I must say though, is that one user can only represent one country. So, if Marcus is going to represent New England, he can't represent Lovia. But, as of now, they` should be associate members, not active ones, so they won't get representation. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 13:17, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Host country?
In the past we had four different systems: Well, I'd say either system two or three. System one fails because people are not willing to join yet another wiki; system four fails because you're working on a wiki of which most people don't understand the language. If we'd choose for system three, Lovia will be our eternal host country. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:05, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Creating a new wiki (effectively, this failed and a new Wikination started on the site)
 * 2) All members are host country for a period (f.e. jan-march: Lovia, april-july: Mäöres, july-etc..)
 * 3) One fixed country which is very active (at the time Libertas)
 * 4) One fixed country which is least active (Adlibita).
 * I like system 2, but won't there be problems with discussions stretching across wikis? Would we have to move the forum every few months? If it's plausible system 2 is certainly the best IMO but otherwise it would be simpler to keep everything in Lovia. --Semyon 14:10, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, a combination of moving and not moving is necessary. You should definitely keep the archives at either one nation or at all nations. Rotation of active discussions is not a problem I think. Simply copying the page will suffice. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:15, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * You are probably right. Well, let's do that then. :P --Semyon 14:21, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * I like to rotation idea. It would also bring users to the other sites. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 14:33, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Languages...
I think we can fix the problems above fairly easily, so let's get to the more sensible stuff. Beginning with: official languages :P I'd say, keep it simple and keep it fair. As we all, with the exception of very few, speak English I propose: When necessary, translations to English are provided. Our working languages will be English and Limburgish. The semi-official language are just because they look nice on the list :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:26, June 13, 2012 (UTC) --Semyon 14:27, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) English (working language)
 * 2) Limburgish (working language)
 * 3) Dutch (semi-official)
 * 4) Unified Mäöres (semi-official)

Perhaps Dutch should be official. It is an official language in Brunant. In a practical sense users like Echocho and Wabba are mainly Dutch speakers and some may be more comfortable expressing ideas in Dutch. HORTON11 : •  14:36, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, the problem is that we should keep it as simple as possible. Translations to Dutch become mandatory the moment it is a working language. Also, as all Dutchies seem to be able to express themselves (albeit for the main part) in English, which is not the case for all Limboes, we should perhaps consider to leave it semi-official. But, if you find somebody willing and able to do the translations; go ahead! :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 14:49, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Dutch would work. But English is best so everyone gets what we mean. :) The glorious First Consul of Rome 15:04, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Are you willing to translate official documents to Dutch? In that case, Dutch can be an official working language. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:06, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Character Wiki
In every previous co-operation every wiki was a character wiki (a wiki like this). However Brunant is not. Should we allow that> Pierlot McCrooke 15:11, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Could you explain what you mean with "character wiki"? As far as I know, users are coupled to a person in Brunant as well. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:13, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Character wiki are wiki's are wiki's like this, wiki's were everyone controls a character, runs with it in eletiosn, and found companies with it. Brunant can be considered a border case (dutchism ) since most people there don't follow it Pierlot McCrooke 15:17, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Gert Henneman (president) = Horton, for the others I don't know. If the system on Brunant is really that different, it wouldn't be too difficult to change it. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:19, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Anyway, Mäöres doesn't even have a real democracy, so.. :P --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:20, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * And anyways characters are not extremely important to this. All you need is to make someone up to fill a role. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 15:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Horton is the only one having a character. Most others follow the encyclopedical style. Damn, where is that blog post from dimitri detailing these various styles? Pierlot McCrooke 15:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * @Horton: Well, in an organization like this, you are doing politics :P So, it would be nice if you have someone to "control" a character if you see what I mean. What happens in Brunant indeed is less relevant. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:24, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Here it is Pierlot McCrooke 15:27, June 13, 2012 (UTC)


 * @ Pierlot- The First lady has her own character, Wabba has 2, I believe but one is primary. Any Ygo has a really old Count-Judge.
 * @ Oos- I meant that one's own character isn't necessary. Just a puppet character which is involved in the relevant field. Perhaps an official representative to the organization. HORTON11 : Email_icon.jpg • follow_me.PNG 15:29, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes but unlike Wikination the characters are mostly uncontrolled Pierlot McCrooke 15:30, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * @Horton: I know, but the characters also need to discuss, so you need a fixed users controlling the "new" characters in the departments. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:34, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * That's because I hardly ever log in, Pierlot. When do you do something with your McCrooke character? The glorious First Consul of Rome 15:39, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Interwiki car: and li:
I requested Wikia to enable interwikis between landj and carrington. They might request a confirmation at Carrington if this is technically possible. --O u WTBsjrief-mich 15:32, June 13, 2012 (UTC)

Supranational pages
I think we allow pages about other nations thingies. But we should have a rule: the country where the subject is located should be another language Pierlot McCrooke 16:22, June 13, 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't really understand... Perhaps you could give us an impression of your idea in Dutch or explain the details a bit more? --O u WTBsjrief-mich 16:26, June 13, 2012 (UTC)